This is the best podcast I’ve ever listened to. Now, granted, I have only listened to a handful in my life; but the depth of thought this put me into every single episode is going to be hard for any future one I listen to rival. Thank you Mike.

As a religious studies and psychology double major who has studied the intersection of high control groups and organized religion for decades, I am stunned that there isn’t a single episode featuring (or even including) insights from an expert in the field of high control groups, such as Dr. Steven Hassan and Dr. Janja Lalich. I sense in the reporting a strong reluctance—if not outright refusal—to acknowledge that Mars Hill (and other churches like it) fit the technical definition of a high control cult. While the podcast does a good job of exposing the horrors of Mars Hill, it does a disservice to not only all Mars Hills survivors but also to all those who feel trapped within the widespread misogyny, authoritarianism, and spiritual abuse of white evangelical Christianity in America today. Mars Hill was not an anomaly. Rather it was the beginning template for creating a cult of personality around a megachurch pastor. And that template has groomed white evangelical Christians to accept, and often outright endorse, the rise of authoritarianism in America because Donald Trump looks and acts no different from the pastors they have dutifully followed for years.

As a former employee of Mars Hill in 2014, this was very healing to listen to. After the gaslighting of 2014, it was so validating to finally hear the truth spoken out loud.

Exceptional reporting, storytelling, and production.

If you do read these reviews Mike, I’d like to say Thank You. The thoughtful, meticulous and well researched reporting for this podcast series blesses me every time I listen to it. I’m excited to start Devil in The Deep Blue Sea. May the Lord richly bless you, your family and your work all the days of your life.

A thorough review of a church and pastor that was a prominent figure in the faith.

This podcast ends with the a couple elders getting fired and then a random Josh Harris interview. How did Mars Hill fall? Are you just supposed to somehow know how this story ends? If so, that is a wildly overblown view of how important this story is. Two stars because they didn’t finish the story and all the corporate ads from better help.

Mark Driscoll first came to my attention when his videos on family relations and boundaries started to come up on my social media. My initial impression of him was that I thought he was biblical, honest, and direct. I found his teachings to be extremely refreshing and relevant to the challenges my husband and I are currently facing but have been struggling to find biblical and reputable resources on. When I went to go see if Mark had a podcast I could listen to, I instead found THIS podcast. Much to my surprise, I had no idea that Mark was actually a fairly well known pastor who had helped in leading a large church. I was even more surprised to find that there was so much controversy behind Mark and his teachings. I immediately became skeptical, considering the fact that he was just some random guy who came up on my Facebook feed and I really had no idea who he was. We all know how easy it is to portray oneself as something we’re not on social media. I decided I wanted to learn more about Mark and this controversy that supposedly was “bad” enough to motivate a group of people to create a 22+ part series on the events that unfolded during the time of Marsh Hill. After listening to the podcast, I have confidently come to the conclusion that Mark Driscoll is a man of God who loves the Lord, loves the word of God, and desires to lead others to know, and love the Lord as well. Does he preach biblically founded messages? Yes and he references the Bible and passages that he’s pulling from in all of his messages. Is he direct? Absolutely. Mark’s intention is not to tell you what you want to hear or tell you things that make you “feel good.” His purpose is to share the word of God, as it is written without being tainted by the worlds notions or his own. He is exactly what we need in a pastor where most churches and leaders water down biblical truth to make everyone in a room feel more comfortable. That is not what we are called to do as believers. If you are skeptical of Mark Driscoll like I was prior to hearing this garbage podcast, I would encourage you to listen through an unbiased lens and come to your own conclusions. Listen to the audio clips of Marks teachings and ask yourself if what he is sharing is Biblically sound - regardless of how it makes you feel or whether you like it or not.

The podcast has a slant but definitely presents all sides. I enjoyed the length.

Originally I thought it was helpful as I had made my departure from an A29 church and less but similar issues. 1. There are some valid points and I did appreciate it as a whole. 2. The “Things we do to Women” episode may be partially true but is filled with problems. First, the women interviewed are all far left leaning and even non-Christians with a clear motive. Second, as a person that did follow Driscoll for some time, even if there were experiences that were contrary, his repeated teaching was fundamentally contrary to what is presented. It is possible that he was a total hypocrite, but my experience was he was very hard on men in sermons but quite soft on women. 3. I always felt uneasy about how things ended with Mars Hill. There is some possibility in my mind with “a trap laid”. Leading up to his end, Driscoll was making moves of being less tribal and seemed to have a more tempered view. I’m sure the ultra-Calvinists in A29 didn’t appreciate this. Everyone knew for years how brutal Mark was. I can assure you as someone in A29 that was never a bug, but from this point all those people changed their tune. I know people who used to worship Driscoll and parrot him but now act like they never knew any of this stuff. In my opinion Chandler kicked Mars Hill out for self-protection. None of the scandal info was news to A29, for all of us around it was common knowledge he was abusive to men. 4. Is also ironic the hypocrisy. By the end CT admits their own issues in their organization. But for me it’s not just that but the credibility of the organization. CT is a far left woke feminist organization and them going on a demon hunt after a differing group means there is zero possibility of objectivity. And that’s mostly what you get out of this.

Christ-less Today is nothing but a slanderous outlet, spewing lies and repeating progressive propaganda. Stay far far away from these whitewashed tombs. They are empty and their fruit is nothing but poison.

Thank you for investing in meaningful investigative journalism. The podcast gave me valuable insight into the consequences of unchecked power within a church. Since I didn’t know exactly how the story was going to end, it played out as a drama that kept my undivided attention. Good job.

Professional, expert, and Biblical Do more of this investigative work

While I can see where they get their thoughts, the language used (ex. Boomers) and the way CT blogged about Driscoll in such negative light without doing the biblical thing which is approaching privately first, gives me pause to believe the story. It feels slanted and defamatory instead of truthful.

This whole story tells me how my generation was influenced, and influenced how the church and evangelicals, especially now, behave… GenXers were big in the church movement in the 90’s and early 2000’s, but from what we got and were bored of, narcissism gains extremely fertile ground. Our parents parents though they were the best generation and the boomers started to think mega movement bringing up super blah churches. And then, we were sick of the annoying church attitudes, so we pushed back with a vengeance building churches centered around ourselves and not the gospel. That may seem convoluted, but look at the progression. Grandparents being told they were the greatest, beginning of narcissism. Their children working to catch up to their parents and going big with big egos, next phase in narcissistic behaviors. Then my generation having been fed all this narcissistic fuel, and firebrands like Driscoll coming out and creating easily followed, easily manipulated communities with their need for supply that their parents never gave them. We created so much chaos with being fed up with our parents annoying church attitudes.

Wow! True journalism at its finest. You can tell there was a lot of time and thought put into this podcast. I knew nothing of Mark Driscoll prior to listening. However, I always got a weird feeling watching his videos pop up on social media and this series confirmed why. Such an easy to binge podcast!! Great job team. More Christian’s need to be aware!

Listening to this podcast has helped me to process through my own experience of spiritual abuse. So many times I felt like I was crazy or maybe the problem really was me, and then I’d listen to Episode and think “Wow!! That happened to me too!” Or “That was said to me too! Almost word for word!” Thank you to the whole team that put this together. You’ve helped me more than I can express. I know that even though there’s no happy ending to my situation either, I’m going to be ok. Thank you for helping me hold onto faith.

"The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill" podcast, when stripped of its religious context, serves as a compelling examination of abusive and manipulative leadership within high-demand authoritarian organizations. This narrative could easily apply to a business, sports team, MLM, or cult, as the behaviors are universally recognizable. The podcast excels in its journalistic approach, meticulously documenting Mark Driscoll’s transformation from a seemingly well-intentioned pastor to a power-hungry, abusive leader. As his influence expanded, so did his authoritarian tendencies, showcasing a textbook case of "us vs. them" and justifying wrong actions for a perceived greater good. The series doesn't attempt to explain why such groups exist, but rather, it highlights that they always have. It vividly portrays how many well-meaning individuals can be misled by a charismatic yet narcissistic leader and his complicit followers. This recurring story underscores the importance of vigilance against those who offer certainty

Fascinating podcast and well researched! It definitely helps point out red flags in regards to abusive leadership. It would have been interesting to hear his reasoning and rational for certain decisions from people who knew his perspective a bit better. I felt like most of the people narrating his intentions and heart behind his decisions had been deeply wounded by him and were probably not coming from a very objective place. He had a lot of support right up until the end so his reasoning must have been both compelling and convincing. All in all a great series!

Here’s the cliff notes. Don’t be like these other Christians. They are bad Christians. Be like us. We are the only good Christians. Our faith is better than their faith. Don’t be like them be like us. I had never even heard of Mark Driscoll until he recently when he got kicked off of stage at a men’s conference. I went online to find out who he was. And stumbled upon this worthless podcast. I guess it’s like watching a train crash. I listen to all the episodes. One train car after another falling off the track making a big mess and destroying things around it. that is this podcast. A big sloppy mess. I had hoped I might learn something, I had even hope I might find some encouragement or something to uplift my faith. I found nothing positive in this podcast. Just a bunch of Christians bashing other Christians. Same stuff you hear in church pulpits every Sunday. Don’t be like those Christians only be like us. I kept waiting for the evidence, the smoking gun, the undeniable proof that Mark Driscoll was unfit for ministry. And maybe the elders of his former church has that evidence. But the producers of this podcast put together a very weak and vague argument to try to prove that Mark Driscoll was a bad pastor. If we were in a court of law he would’ve been exonerated of all charges. But even in today’s society of public opinion is considered truth, I’m just not sure this podcast proved enough of it thesis that Mark was a bad pastor. The self reporting of themselves (christianity today) and their own sexual allegations within their own company turns out to be even worse than some of the allegations they were making against others.

Wow, truly excellent form of journaling. You guys did a great job. I followed Driscoll for many many years until I heard about what he did to his church. And now I see histology is off. “The greater the power, the more dangerous the abuse”

It’s sad to see how empty all of your attacks are against Mark’s gifting in pointing others to biblical understanding and strengthening the family unit under submitting to Christ. Yet it’s clear as day why your pursuit doesn’t stop you from trying to cultivate a narrative that feeds the true intent behind this, which was a hunger for changing/controlling the calling Jesus assigned and established through this ministry to begin with. It’s sad, but it reflects how we are all sinners and in need of grace. I pray for humility, hearts that submit to Christ and discernment that leads to turning from worthless arguments that stem from jealousy/control, because we see where that leads…. It leads to deeper hurt and division that was unnecessary. Is Mark a sinful man? Yes, we all are! Has Mark every changed up from the assignment the Lord has assigned him? No. His track record is a testimony of what the Lord has called him to do, and because of that people are being reached with the gospel everyday. Is Mark a sinful man? Yes, we all are! Has Mark ever changed up from the assignment the Lord has assigned him? No. His track record is a testimony of what the Lord has called him to do, and because of that, people are being reached with the gospel every day. By the way, I’m a 25-year-old single woman who has been BLESSED by the Lord through teachings and encouragement through that assigned ministry. God bless.

I have been under leadership like Mark’s before and felt the feelings that have been expressed by those in his orbit. But I also know that there is a good person hidden underneath the facade of people like Mark. This is a beautiful and unbiased telling of Mars Hill’s story and has been a conduit of healing in my life after my own personal experiences. Thankful for The Rise & Fall of Mars Hill

I knew nothing of Mars Hill before listening to this podcast, which was recommended to me by an acquaintance. I enjoyed every minute and it was fascinating to listen to.

Thanks so much for this. I had heard about it and finally listened to it. Lots to learn from here. Would be interesting to hear some follow up stories since Mark Driscoll doesn’t seem to have learned anything or changed for the better. I heard so much pain in these episodes from the people who were hurt by this, and I hope they can find healing.

Heard about this podcast and the content has been great. It is heartbreaking to hear certain things yet it is not uncommon across the nation. Well-produced and balanced with great information.

the bobby knight episode is the weakest and most random stretch in this series. brings on people who aren’t even biblical pastors and stretches the analogy and problem big time.

Very well done- right depth of journalism without burying us in detail. This could have been a self righteous spectacle, but their representation of the societal and church background leaves us recognizing our part in producing celebrity pastors as well as the pressure these leaders are under. Loved the balance and selection of background music as well!

Doesn’t show you much about personal relationship with God, but helps you see deeply into how people use God for their own benefit. 1 Tim 6:3-5 Speaking of: are y’all going to do a podcast on ACC Waco, IHOP KC, or Bethel?

Funny how instead of a podcast with purpose it basically became a smear campaign in which only made cooper look like an woke, idiot baby and now mark driscoll is more popular than ever. Seriously such a big L for Christianity today

2 stars because it’s decently produced. Mike injects his own opinion and this is like his own therapy session where he sounds like a non Christian who is trying to make sense of this whole story from a worldly perspective, quoting any and everything but the Bible. Ironically the one who opens the Bible the most in this “Christian” podcast is Driscoll.

Listened to a few episodes until it was apparent this was a hit piece from a liberal “Christian” organization. Don’t waste your time

CT doing a hit piece on anyone is the embodiment of Luke 6:42. After reading article after article from CT that are inherently dishonest, written to promulgate progressive ideology instead of biblical worldview, let’s just say I have a hard time believing I’m getting factual information instead of a left wing agenda. That being said, Mars Hill and Mark Driscoll had many problems, I think it’s a problem that extends to many mega churches, built around a leader instead of Jesus. But Mark Driscoll is a mixed bag, he’s someone I’ve heard great sermons from, while at the same time, wouldn’t let him have eldership or pastoral authority over me.

A broken man meeting Christ who ends up helping other broken men and women. Mark was trying his best. He sounds like he has trauma with his great distrust. He needed accountability and pushed it away. The show is anti-Calvinism, anti-masculinity. It started so strong with the polemic on mega churches and ended with a theological bent. Scott McKnight, Russel Moore, and the like want to leave Reformational truth. The Joshua Harris was interesting but the interviews were mostly one sided (besides Colin Hanson). Hyper-masculinity is not a John Wayne and Jesus problem, it is a male issue. Andrew Tate and the like. Young men need healthy masculinity modeled and Jesus is the god-guy for them! Jesus is gangsta with his diatribes (Matt. 23) and no fear mentality (Calming storms, facing mobs and kings). He was the paradoxical kind and strong. It will be interesting to what CT does next…

I love pumpkin pie!

Heard the name Mars Hill come up in a casual conversation so I looked it up and found this podcast. For a production put out by an org called Christianity Today, it’s disappointing to hear they accepted sponsorship and were willing to promote Better Help to listeners. It just feels broken and baseless to push people into the arms of a secular “therapy” corporation offer instead of into faith. Seems bizarre and shallow to me.

No spoilers, just a warning: only watch this if you are not sensitive about people getting mistreated, if you get easily angered, DON’T WATCH, otherwise, 11/10 podcast

What a story! Sobering. Heart-breaking. Well-told. Thank you for telling it.

This podcast was good and I really enjoyed the story as well as the deep insight and research. However you have to listen to this podcast with a grain of salt. CT has become so progressive and liberal in the last 10 years that I don’t trust everything they’re saying. I have to always reframe what’s being said in light of it being said by liberal Christians. I’m not at all a supporter of Mars Hill. I honestly had never heard of them except in passing. After hearing this podcast I am just brokenhearted for the people of that area who trusted and then were hurt. It’s so sad to see Christians who can’t just speak the truth of the gospel instead of making everything about power and control. It’s so true that power corrupts. Every. Single. Time. P.S. Do Christians not set themselves apart with their language. I’m astounded at the casual swearing that many former Mars Hill “pastors” and leaders find so easy to do. Aren’t we supposed to be in the world but not of it?

Episode 4 was especially horrible. The church HAS gotten more feminine, the men in church HAVE become soft, the feminist movement HAS emasculated men and that is definitely A reason a lot of men don’t go to church. Church caters to women. Mark has a message for men that the younger generations definitely need to hear. Look, I don’t know what you’re trying to accomplish with this. Until about 3 weeks ago, I had never heard of Mars Hill or Mark Driscoll. To act like he’s some sort of church rock star is ludicrous. He clearly had/has a winning formula. He made some mistakes. Sounds like he got in his flesh. Maybe became prideful. He’s got a new church and here you are with a podcast making money off of an unfortunate situation. Who’s being glorified while you’re doing this? I don’t think it’s Jesus. In my limited exposure to his sermons, he’s barely mentioned Mara Hill. You’re here with an entire freakin podcast and reviewers from Portland are giving poor reviews to his new church not because they have been. But because they “THINK he MIGHT be doing the same thing.” Praise Got that souls are being saved. Stop being petty.

I have listened to many podcasts but this one is different. Why? It’s heart! There’s a commitment to look honestly at what is ailing the church. The only negative thing about this podcast is that it ends. Thank you CT for your commitment to professional and honest journalism.

Weak evidence, long winded, and boring. Great way to build a following and make a living these days though, gj on that.

I have listened to The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill at least 4 times now. Every time I listen to it, I observe something I missed prior. Also, every time I listen, my heart is saddened even more by what Mark Driscoll has done to the congregation of Mars Hill. Having been a part of Harvest Bible Chapel, it’s devastating when these pastors place themselves above Jesus outside of the pulpit. Mike Cosper does an amazing job telling this story. Very well detailed and organized and his storytelling captivates the listener. I pray for the people who have been hurt by Driscoll and I pray for the congregation in which he is continuing to lie to in Scottsdale, AZ.

When you encourage deconstruction by having progressive ex-christians on your podcast and start spouting liberal ideology, you have stopped trying to speak truth to help people and start trying to advance a narrative that not Jesus centered. This is harmful to people who have been hurt by church leaders. You should be ashamed of yourselves for taking advantage of people’s hurt in order for you to build a platform. I pray you repent and turn from your critical ways.

I’m not someone who is good with words nor have had a broad sense of what has been happening in and with the church. I knew something was off but couldn’t quite figure out what is was. For me I think it’s a sense of for so many it is no longer about Jesus but about marketing themselves or about how great they are doing (while thinking it proves Jesus is with them) Through this podcast Mike has really gotten me to see to the core of small steps and decisions over time that have gotten us to where we are now and how do we move forward. A reminder that we all are broken. Never before has the phrase you “don’t throw the baby out with the bath water” made more sense.

The host is too liberal and only trying to push a liberal theology. This could have been covered in half as much time as it’s goes off into so many tangents. All the usual whining is here just because someone preaches truth in very bold ways. Mark wasn’t everyone’s cup of tea but neither is Christianity Today.

The first 4 episodes were fantastic. The expanse history of the mega church was great. In a swift change, CT in episode 5, speak to a non-Christian who infiltrated Mars Hill and wrote her own book tearing down the church. It’s deplorable. Then in episode 5 - they only speak to women who again probably have never read Song of Solomon. It was all about how these women “feel” and the shame they felt. The Bible is the Bible and you have to accept it all. Not only what didn’t make you feel shame or easy to digest. This is a podcast full of heresy.

It’s the specificity that expands to universal. I love Mike Cosper’s brain. I leave every episode with a nugget that informs how I see the world. Thanks for the thoughtful work 🙏🏽

This podcast exposed me to another level of understanding of the narcissist patterns of some pastors in the Church.

I’ve listened to six of the episodes and I’m still waiting for some type of direction such as “where we go from here” or “here is a framework to make better decisions as a church” or at least the “why” of creating such a podcast and how it benefits the church. I’m left with more questions than answers and a feeling that a person has been judged and analyzed to a level that is reserved for his maker alone. I don’t know, I personally am not comfortable with the public judging and shaming of another but I also know that toxic cultures need to be brought into light. No doubt there were alarming and troubling things revealed in this story. Also alarming was how people were so quick to follow someone solely because he has power and authority. That troubles me just as much. As believers we can absolutely look to our leaders who live in a way that honors God and imitate their ways but at the end of the day people are fallen sinners and should never be thought of as the final authority. Scripture alone revealed through the Holy Spirit to a heart that is connected to God is where we find our compass. I’m undecided on this piece and if it is beneficial to listen to. I guess it depends on your motive. If your looking for help analyzing a culture for your spiritual health then maybe. Just be careful to avoid an attitude of pride along the way.